Double Vision?! "Heeelp! Plus Lens Messing Up My Eyes!"

For most of everyone here, reversing myopia is kind of a “duh” thing almost in many ways, being how obvious it all becomes in hindsight.

But the newbie stories of finding ways to screw it up, never stop.

Yes usually it’s just recurring themes. People looking for shortcuts and ways to avoid the obvious (ie less screen time, less addictive behaviors, more using biology as intended).

Also this is why I don’t talk about plus lenses much at all.

In fact plus lenses can be VERY useful especially at the last diopter, and for myopia prevention in children. Possibly one of my favorite (semi-secret) tools. If you watch / listen to some of the podcasts you likely catch me talking about it.

But not in general public spaces, because these little f*ckers will absolutely, guaranteed latch on to “the thing” that’s the magic shortcut and then screw up their vision and then go “ohhhh Jake messed up my eyes”.

This guy didn’t but there was a solid year there somewhere in the past where “plus lens therapy” somehow became a bit of a thing, and my inbox was an endless nightmare of people complaining about plus lenses (and it wasn’t anything I started at all - seems like it originated somewhere in the Todd Becker camp / forum).

Long and short of it, me thinks that some of these things are going to live in paid courses. Not to extract money (well, yea that also), but to make sure some firm commitment is made, things are taken less out of context, and it’s not monkeying around with focal planes, looking to somehow shortcut things with “this one thing”.

Side note here also, been working for some time on a consistent approach for the ‘last diopter’ challenges faced by many. Slightly more challenging since yes, a bit of plus can be involved, which seems to work very differently for different individuals. Sorting out where it’s age, vs. habits, vs. things not mentioned by participants, how much it’s being substituted for good outdoor time, how much of that stimulus is effective vs. how much distance time must be added (turning out to be a key ingredient).

Haven’t stopped working on things, even if I’m generally somewhat quiet here online, the blog, videos, etc. More time spent on the upcoming phone app, and some of the behind-the-scenes.

Hope ya’lls having a good time anyway, with all of your darling eyeballs!

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Minus or plus, lenses are all a spectrum, there’s nothing magical about crossing over 0, you’re still sending light into a heavily plus lensed system. But adding plus lens therapy too soon is dropping too many diopters at once, which is going to have the same negative effects as dropping too many diopters at once.

I’m really enjoying my plus lenses over contacts, but they’re just bringing me back to the minus correction I think I should be at instead of what the doc thinks I should be at.

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There is definitely something going on with “crossing over 0”. Peripheral defocus, maybe. No question though that things get funky.

Kids for example, using plus lens for prevention, or to some degree with very low myopia, works almost every time. Very few surprises.

Adults in same situation? Different story. Ghosting / double vision / headaches, all kinds of things go on (or not at all). Found some common denominators that appear to address issues. Possibly.

Older yet? Now there’s presbyopia potential involved and it’s another story yet again.

And of course, plus over contacts is another story yet again. That usually, works fine.

I’m looking at all of these things only from a practical perspective of what actually happens with focal plane changes. The why and how, maybe best left to the big brains here in the forum. :wink:

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Thanks Jake for posting this. Have been curious what the issues with plus glasses are. I volunteer to be another datapoint when my diopters drop enough :slight_smile:

Really weird what’s happening to these people. You’re wise to limit discussion of plus glasses, there’s something going on, and until we know more, it’s best to keep it close to the chest and pull it out to help some people get past the last diopter.

I realized I was wrong in my 1-year-update thread. I have used plus glasses before. Back in 2002 I was still using contact lenses, and when I started using what we call “differentials” to reduce eye strain, I’d wear +1 to +1.5 el cheapo readers on top of my contacts for computer work. As you mention, that does work, had no issues, and was able to reduce eyestrain completely. I eventually ditched the contacts (they started getting really uncomfortable) and used two pairs of glasses (one for PC, one for everything else) for the next 17 years before last year. Now those PC glasses are my astronomy glasses, and make bright stars into pinpricks :wink:

And you’re right, plus glasses work for kids. My 7 year old showed signs of myopia, I managed to measure it (about 0.25-0.5D) and promptly ordered some +1.5’s from Zennis. She only wears them for close-up work and I encourage her to wear them them for any sustained close-up. After about two months, she got back to eagle-eyed distance vision. I’m confident that we can keep her emmetropic for the rest of her life, and not follow in the footsteps of her father, aunt, uncle, grandfather, grandmother, etc.

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Many thanks for all this information. As a newbie I already learned you should never do any funky stuff that you don’t understand. Starting out at -1.0 Low Myopia and I guess it’s just super tempting to pick up one of those cheap plus lenses.

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Yes, this.

What’s most exiting to me is having access to a large, willing group of … test subjects. :wink: It’s what made BackTo20/20 so fantastically effective (and trickled down into all the free resources), being able to introduce small tweaks based on feedback and issues via direct support, and then getting a lot of data on how the changes affect progress.

Plus use, along with some proportionate amount of distance vision, is definitely a very good tool for the last diopter. Just that it’s not sorted yet to a point where I’d be reasonably comfortable staying, “yes this works”.

For kids though, definitely. Only issue here is my concern that we’re dealing with a “third party” with possibly limited capacity for feedback, which if promoted on a larger scale could lead to unexpected issues. Last thing I want is to be responsible for any child related vision issues, having promoted plus lenses universally as child myopia prevention.

So much, if not all of this, some unsanctioned, “at your own risk”, biohacking type stuff. For every rule, a dozen exceptions and clarifications and details alway seem to be required.

Is it possible that it is purely the adult that is getting in the way? I imagine a child just gets on with it, along with the ‘play’ that goes along with being a child. Whereas adults love to fiddle and know best - try active focus (or their attempt at it) or some other muscle pulling activity and experiment - rather than just letting the lens be.

Of course it can be anything. I just find the whole thought interesting!

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Children usually only have ciliary spasm. That’s why plus lenses are more effective with them. If you had 20 years more of using your eyes, you had more time to gain various optic malfunctions, that were hidden under the glasses. I’m bashing this theme all the time, but it’s worth repeating. If you sit wrongly for a long time, you can one day discover that something in your back doesn’t work properly. Doesn’t mean you have to have good posture all the time, but the more you do it, the higher the chance sth will go wrong more permanently.

If you had these issues 20 years it’s completely something different in terms of reversing than 3 months.

And last diopter isn’t only about ciliary spasm and axial length. There are other problems that you can have there. For one example you can look through one eye not through the center. It’s same mild squint or strabismus, that isn’t categorized as a one because it’s too small. But you gained it like you would bad back. This thing is not so easy to unlearn but it can cause myopic symptoms. No matter how much time you use plus lenses or how big powers, it will not in any way shape of form reduce it.

that was me . i was total newbie . i only have one eye and i was so terrified about having myopia that only gets worse over the time that is why i was trying different stuffs and how can you fix something without knowing how it work ? i learnt my lesson . Internet is full of bullshits and you should question everything no need to rush and learn before taking any steps . anyways that time i was -1.75 not -1.5 and now im -1.25(ophthalmologist confirmed ) .thankfully that weird double vision stopped occuring . these days im alternating between challenging my eyes outdoors with no glasses and then wear -1.25 when i need them or when i get tired of af or when i want to enjoy effortless clarity …

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and yeah never mess with plus lens unless you do know what you are doing …

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could you please help me on this.
i also used plus lenses over contacts. now i am getting double vision. How you have have solved your problem.
I am getting double vision in my both eyes.

What kind of double vision you have ?