Shaerah's low myopia moderate astigmatism dry eyes presbyopia path

I wish I had something to contribute. At the moment I wanted a place to log this. We shall see if I get anywhere. I actually did pass the vision screening last time at the DMV. Though I now wear glasses to drive, I have no restriction on my driver’s license. I used artificial tears shortly before I read the chart.

My spouse does not believe in this process, so we shall see what happens when he does my next refraction. In the mean time I am figuring things out with a trial lens kit. I can’t measure centimeters because between presbyopia and astigmatism, I can’t tell the difference between blurry and the start of less or more blur.

OD 20/50
OS 20/50+, even clearer than the right.

Starting out
I found my refraction was over-correcting the left eye by -0.25, so I theoretically dropped a quarter and started with:

OD -1.00 - 1.25
OS -1.50 - 1.25

First Differentials
The various caveats and permutations of how to manage things like unequal refractive error between eyes, reduced need for cylinder at near, more cylinder than sphere all left me at a standstill so I took advice to keep it simple and for 72 cm computer work ordered my

OD plano -1.00
OS -0.50 -1.00

  1. reduced sphere by 1 diopter and
  2. shaved off a quarter cylinder

In my mind this cyl. reduction was justified for 2 reasons:

  1. Keratometer readings show -1.00 cyl. in both eyes and I’ve had -1.00 cyl. in other refractions.
  2. Cylinder errors are not as much of a problem at near. One could drop up to -0.75 cyl. for differentials.

Besides, I go around uncorrected at near and distance. I’m uncomfortable with the idea of adding minus at the computer, but my intention was to stop leaning in sometimes to see and STOP the practice of reading things blurred- to learn what it is to see clearly.

Preparing for normalized
I am debating whether I should add in the -0.25 cylinder and reduce only sphere as suggested for first normalized.

Reviewing options

If I were to reduce distance correction by 0.25 sphere it would be not enough challenge:
OD -0.75 -1.25 = 20/20
OS -1.25 -1.25 = 20/20
If I reduce until I get to 20/30 and not reading much of 20/20 line it is a large reduction and great difference between sphere and cylinder:
-0.25 -1.25 = 20/30
-0.25 -1.25 = 20/30

If I leave off that quarter of cylinder it is still reading the same line, maybe less sharply:
-0.25 -1.00 = 20/30
-0.25 -1.00 = 20/30
Any reduction more conservative than this is still reading the 20/20 line.

It doesn’t seem possible both eyes can have the same refraction since when reading, it is clear that the left eye has a closer near point than the right. And these numbers don’t seem right. I suppose it is possible that sitting with my trial lens kit in front of the 20 ft. Snellen chart trying all these combinations I have just discovered active focus and these numbers aren’t reliable. It just occurred to me that I have been using my new moist heat eye mask the last few days. I bet that is helping the tear film and potentially affecting acuity.

I’m going to leave it for another day, but since a month has passed with these differentials I am feeling an urgency to

  1. Stop wearing over-corrected progressive lenses for distance
  2. Stop going uncorrected and learn to see the world clearly.
August 23, 2021 If I were to do it over...

I would try for differentials:
OD -0.50 -0.50
OS -1.00 -0.50


Usually, equal keratometer and refractometer cylinder values mean a ciliary spasm.
Normally they would differ by 0.50-1.00 less of cylinder shown in refractometry vs keratometry.

There are literally no people with no keratometric cylinder in both eyes and in any time of the day :slight_smile:

Looks like you joined 4-years ago but, just starting out?

You are in good company.

Two things:

  • Be patient because improvements at low diopters may take time

  • Use the search tool and read everything you can about “prescription complexity” because your high cyl/sph ratio can cause weirdness

Best of luck.


I found End Myopia a year ago and forgot about it but have been aware of the potential to reduce myopia for years. I just didn’t know where the secret lay. “Take Off Your Glasses and See” was not for me but the idea got me out of my glasses enough to pass the vision screening for my driver license. “The Bates Method…” sounded crazy, imagining a black dot. Now that I’ve read a lot more I can see how some of that makes sense. Searching for not-Bates is how I re-found End Myopia.

Thanks. Probably need to read it all more than once. There are too many variables.

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Weird. Says you joined in 2017?

if it was 2017 it would say '17. she joined the 17th of february.


LOL yeah, I guess …reading would be good.

My first normalized are here. I can already see they are not right.
OD 20/20+
OS 20/30+

OD -0.50 -1.00
OS -0.50 -1.00

I knew there was something weird about both eyes seeing the same thing those two days.

My left eye was on fire! I was using my trial lenses, subtracting a quarter diopter at a time and it kept on seeing 20/30+. I could even see 20/30+ with nothing! But I knew plano was not right. And why was my left eye better than my right? So I slept on it.

The next morning the same- left eye saw 20/30+ with no correction. I thought, “I’ve got to get out of this over-correction of -1.75 -1.25 ASAP,” and I ordered my first normalized. Actually, my differentials have too much correction for the left eye and I’ve been wearing them some for distance (clue) so I ordered the same frames but with one lens to swap for near (OS) and one lens for distance (OD).

Maybe it was a clear “flash” that lasted overnight if that is even possible. My eyes are back to normal - 20/50, 20/70 now. And my right eye sees too well and/or the left sees too poorly with these normalized.

I reduced sphere and cylinder and equalized all in one step. I didn’t mean to do it. I thought, “-0.25 cyl.- I won’t miss that,” and “but my left eye and right eye see the same with the same correction here (even though I know that can’t be right).”

For the time being, these normalized are better than either over-correction or none (blur bliss) at distance. Maybe I should order another pair to de-equalize with less correction for right eye, more for left- try both out.

August 23, 2021 If I were to do it over...

I would get for normalized:
OD -1.00 -0.75
OS -1.50 -0.75

More light
My desk now faces the window with a 10 ft Snellen chart next to it and I am just 10 feet away.

Clearing ghosting!
About a week ago while looking at subtitles there was ghosting – almost double vision. That was new for me but I had read about it. I kept looking at it and the “ghost” moved in toward the clear text. Just for a moment until it moved out, then back in. I couldn’t get it to stick for long, but I did this for a while as practice with each eye.

But then I stopped wearing my normalized because I was worried about the high cylinder/low sphere. I’m waiting for updated ones to come.

Active focus
I guess I won’t chase active focusing. I think I’ve been active focusing with the Snellen chart already for a while. It’s hard to test my acuity without doing it.

Measuring centimeters!
Just now looking at “FOCUS” on the focal calculator I was able to discern clarity vs blur. This is a big thing for me because previously it seemed text was never clear so I couldn’t tell what was what. I’m getting better at seeing what I am seeing – or I am seeing better. So now I have my first measurements.

OD: 82 cm (-1.25)
OS: 67 cm (-1.50)

This is really exciting to see that I can use this commonly used method and tool and now have another way to measure progress. And the correction is a spherical equivalent in line with the norms with cylinder that are on their way to me.


New normalized just arrived today. Exciting feeling!

OD -0.75 -0.75
OS -1.25 -0.75

This correction is based on

  1. reducing 0.50 from current cylinder (-1.25)
  2. Snellen vision with trial frames

I felt I had to keep lowered sphere because I was seeing so well. With this current correction both eyes seem similarly “blurred” at distance.

Visual Acuity - N2
OU 20/15 -3 (good light)

Obviously this seems over-corrected. I am still going to wear them for a while to try to achieve gains in clarity and become accustomed to the lowered astigmatism correction. I don’t know why I love cylinder so much during a refraction.

The not so funny thing is, with my “full correction” I have always been able to make out very little of the 20/15 line in the clinic. I am so looking forward to my next official refraction.


I’m in the same situation! (completely different subscription though) I recently got my N2s as well and I can also make out the 20/15 line in good lighting. I think I’m going to wait at least 4 weeks or by the time my right eye catches up before reducing again.

Seems like you’ll get some good gains soon. Good luck!

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Good luck to you too! I agree. I will wait at least 4 weeks just on principle.

This is great and must feel very encouraging :blush:
I fully understand your slow approach and with cyl I consider that is the right way (only exception may be the first drop - but even that is not for everyone.).

Just remember that the opto will measure your vision in a dark room.
You can easily have a 0.5D drop just because of the difference in lights.


I’m patching the right eye 15 minutes a day.

Un-ghosting practice
I practice making the ghosting go away with subtitles every day, one eye at a time. I don’t see it with both eyes together. Right eye hardly has any (right-down). Left eye has more (left-down). It’s getting easier to resolve.

After I get this left eye ghosting to go away permanently I’ll reduce cyl again or reduce left eye sphere. I forget which is more important at this stage. I’ll find it again…

How To Reduce Prescription Complexity - Endmyopia® - Understanding Nearsightedness


OD plano -0.25
OS -0.25 -0.25

I got the barest minimal correction so I can see clear text at the computer at the edge of blur with both eyes.


Using no diffs lately, I’ve been leaning on the computer desk with my chin in my hands. Then I catch myself and stop. And when one eye is clear the other is blurred. It really is just the slightest difference but when I take them off, I have to get my left eye closer and then my right eye checks out due to presbyopia.

Normalized inside is not working for me.

Indoor challenge

I’ve been using no correction around the house. Any work I do (dishes, paper, cooking) is too blurred with norms on - too much minus. Going without correction is not a good solution as that is where I was when I started EM.

I wonder if other presbyopes see fine indoors with their norms. I do fine with more cyl and less sphere correction, but I’m trying to reverse that.

Distance acuity
Left eye sees more sharply at distance than right with norms.

I’ve committed to doing the white-on-black circles exercise from the astigmatism app.


I wonder if this astigmatism will ever clear. I’ve had cyl since my first glasses. It’s only been a few weeks, but it feels like nothing will change.

Still, I pull out the trial lenses and see how I do with 0.25 less cylinder. Blurred 20/20, 10:00 at night, 13 lux with -1.00 -0.50, -1.25 -0.50.

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Unless you have cataracts or actual corneal aberration something like that I would bet that it will eventually clear. One thing you might keep in mind is that there’s a big “mental” part of astigmatism. Just sitting down and relaxing or meditating can drop -0.5 CYL in 20 minutes, it’s kind of like blood pressure or your heart rate in that stress can make it worse. Astigmatism can go up or down considerably on the same day. LASIK surgeons notice differences in astigmatism just from patients lying down vs sitting (they’re measuring with very accurate equipment).

So all that is a long way of saying try not to worry about it too much. Keep doing what you’re supposed to be doing, and most or all of it will go away in its own time.

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What’s your axis per eye?

At the beginning of January it was:
Right CYL -0.5 axis 90
Left CYL -0.75 axis 75

4 months later it was:
Right -0.25 CYL axis 95
Left -0.25 CYL axis 70

(as measured by same optometrist). In January they had -0.25 SPH in both eyes, in April no SPH.

I don’t see any astigmatism now when I use the astigmatism fan. That having been said, at night sometimes I still get some ghosting on the moon, not always though. So it’s mostly gone.

What’s your axis per eye?

095 both eyes. This has been very stable within 10 degrees over the years since I paid attention ~1987. I don’t perceive directional blur with both eyes, I just see less clearly. I have been trying to train myself to understand what I see. I only see directional blur when I cover one eye.

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Wow! How long had you used cylinder correction?

I love the astigmatism wheel. I didn’t even know it was a thing and I was supposedly “in the biz.”

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