Streamers / pro gamers not getting myopia?

I was just thinking about how these people who sits in front of their screens hours upon hours daily without much breaks can still maintain perfect or atleast not have their vision worsen? Since from some of Jake’s research our eyes change and react from different stimuli right. Then something should have happened to these people’s eyes? Or maybe not?

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Myopia, like most other vision abnormalities, is the result of the interaction between genes and environment. If you do not have the genetic predisposition for myopia, the environment of continuous close vision is likely to have little impact other than making your eyes tired.

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That kinda sucks, I think Asians are more prone to have myopia right? Saw it in one of the studies I read awhile ago.

Yes, it sucks, but so do many other genetic predispositions :slightly_frowning_face:. Fortunately for my daughter she did not inherit my predisposition to myopia, and no amount of book reading from early youth or hours of screen work (she is a translator) and screen-based entertainment has made her myopic.
I suspect there are some other genetic advantages to being East Asian, which may compensate for the higher rates of myopia. :grinning:

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Each ethnic group has a set of genetic predispositions, a response to which becomes a part of their culture. Question is whether the group or community can acknowledge the more recently emerging patterns and take a collective action. It should absolutely be a part of the government’s health policy for that region. Sadly it isnt.

Touch screens have been around for 12 years only right? So perhaps the real natives havent turned into professional gamers yet? By real natives I mean people who started holding a small screen at a dangerously close distance from their eyes from the age of 4 or 5. The computer geek stereotype does have someone with a pair of glasses, so…

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Yeah. Breaks. No, you don’t need breaks every 20 minutes. Jake also says that you can totally get away with breaks every 3 hour. And you only need 3 hours of good quality distance vision per day.
Also it’s much harder to get myopic than worsen when you are already myopic. We don’t know the exact reasons, but most likely increased blur sensitivity is one of them ( https://community.endmyopia.org/t/gems-endmyopia-journey/8419/355 ). As an analogy think about how it’s harder to break your leg, than re-injure and already broken leg.

So yeah, they are not superhumans, they don’t know any cheat or shortcuts. They can get away with close-up because they still have enough distance vision. And don’t forget they only need maintenance, they don’t need to improve. Also while they may have won the genetic lottery but I’m pretty sure that only means for example that they need breaks every 3.5 hours and not every 3 hours.

Why do I think all of these? Because I’m sitting before the screen 12+ hours every day, except for weekends. And I’m improving, starting from -4.25. But then home office happened, habits totally changed, and I needed a lot of experiments to get back to correct habits and improve again.
It’s not genetics, it’s not tricks. It’s habits.

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How many pro gamers do you know who don’t wear glasses BUT need to have sharp vision at distance (not just in the kitchen-bathroom-bedroom triangle or at the local grocery shop or usual takeaway, but e.g also plays golf or squash ((following quick moving small object outside of 4m)) or drives longer distances at night on unknown roads and motorways) AND have an opto confirmed 20/20?

And there are always the extremes at both ends, the myops by default and the never myops. But they’re not the average…

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Do we really know this? It sounds like grasping at straws to me. Why is it so hard to allow the genes/environment hypothesis? We do so for many other health conditions, so why not for myopia. This does not preclude the possibility of reversing myopia with more challenge and better habits. Epigenetics works in both directions - we can switch genes on and off.

Yes, we have been here before. :wink:

What do you mean by environment? As I understand environment it’s really similar to what I call habits.

Genes: I acknowledge that they matter as I mentioned. But I cannot accept that only genes could determine that someone gets myopic or not. If genes would be responsible for that, they would have some eye defect since birth. I accept that you take 2 humans, somehow force them to have the exact same habits and one of them would reach -2.00 myopia and the other -3.00. But not that one of them has no myopia at all, but the other one has -3.00. Genetics is sort of a long-lasting buzzword, and only in the recent years they start to realize how less they really matter. Yes, they can predispose to things. But they don’t determine things. When they do, it’s clearly visible from the start (ie.: birth defects).

Yeah, also good point. And you also don’t know if a pro gamer wear contact lenses. Based on the actual streams you cannot be sure they have any clear vision beyond their screens.

Agreed, although nutrition could also play a role here.

In no way am I claiming this, although it does unfortunately apply to a very few cases of vision defects.

I don’t agree with this. My genetic predisposition to metabolic syndrome was certainly not visible from my birth. Neither was it for myopia.

I would not be so confident about the outcome of such an experiment.

How little they matter in which areas of human biology? Height, skin colour, eye colour, hair colour and texture, FH and other metabolic disorders, etc. etc.? Genetics (and epigenetics) is just taking off, and is far from being a buzzword.

But we will, again, politely agree to differ, if that is still possible in our current cultural climate. :grinning:

My last attempt - parting shot?

Height is not determined by genetics alone. Environment, food and habits during childhood have a huge impact on it. You are right for eye and hair color / texture, but those are just nuances from evolutionary standpoint for humans.
Familial hypercholesterolemia can be diagnosed from birth. If not (ie.: you produce normal cholesterol levels then at some later point of life you have high cholesterol) then it’s a misdiagnosis. Unfortunately it happens a lot of times.

I think that genetics only determine how much you can abuse your body. And which parts will fail first. It’s true just as much for myopia as for metabolic disorder. If you are in a healthy environment, consuming healthy foods and drinks and have healthy habits then they don’t really matter (unless really old age where they again determine what fails first) and homo sapienses will behave really similarly. How do you determine what healthy means? Those environments, foods and habits where you won’t see the difference in genetics until really old age :slight_smile:

From the study:

However, few positive association results have been convincingly replicated in independent samples, and refractive error susceptibility alleles identified to date are generally estimated to have low or modest effect sizes.

Which pretty much the same as

:slight_smile:

Immediately followed by :
This implies that most genetic variants involved in human myopia and refractive control are yet to be discovered. It is also probable that variants in several genes interact with one-another, as well as with environmental factors, to mediate ocular growth and produce the distributions of refraction observed in human populations.’

Not exactly counter to your point about contacts but There’s def an increase in glasses wearers amongst the streamers i watch since the onset of Covid-19.

So net net - one doesn’t know and cannot know. Try to prevent it, and dont take it to heart if you cant.

Liberating.

Or simply there is none :man_shrugging:

A more recent study has found some more candidates.

And how could one falsify/validate this? A shrug of the shoulders is not enough.
:grinning:

You pretty much can’t falsify, it’s like falsify that aliens exists. You can validate if you can find some allele which significantly linked to myopia regardless of location and culture. At least in large scale studies, but ideally by separated identical twins, but I don’t think that will happen :slight_smile:

I wonder if some gamers are helped by their distance to screen. If you are very absorbed by your computer/TV screen, you won’t be spending as much time on your smart phone… :wink:

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